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Post by Zizhun on Feb 20, 2015 7:18:44 GMT -8
Hmm, I like the idea of him sneaking aboard at kings cross. More time for him to get into mischief that way. Do you like that idea?
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Post by Medieval Kevin on Feb 20, 2015 7:29:28 GMT -8
I like it, so they will be together then on the ride to school :-)
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Post by Hollywood Heidi on Feb 21, 2015 22:58:25 GMT -8
Hey guys! So wanted to see if we can brainstorm and come up with a fun, Potteresque term for these Muggles who become magical, thanks to Kevin's character. Definitely the main word for it and maybe even a derogatory one (i.e. mudblood).
Also, I'm having trouble remembering the last couple HP books and movies. I know that the wizarding war bled into the Muggle world. Did it leave any effect on the Muggles or do they not remember anything that happened and are still completely oblivious to the whole wizarding world?
I remember them starting something in the Muggle world, some dark clouds forming and such, and we can even use that as perhaps part of what started making a rare crop of muggles turning to magical which leads to Kevin's character wanting to research this and make more?
Let me know if that doesn't fit or if I'm remembering incorrectly!
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Post by Medieval Kevin on Feb 21, 2015 23:04:08 GMT -8
I think i remember they kept it under wraps right up until voldemort killed scrimgour. there attacks seemed impersonal, storms, bridge collapses. Even if people thought it was deliberate i think the wizarding worlds secret remains safe
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Post by Vye on Feb 21, 2015 23:06:33 GMT -8
A term for the muggles who get magic could be something along the lines of fools gold since they aren't real wizards.
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Post by Hollywood Heidi on Feb 21, 2015 23:19:53 GMT -8
Thanks for the refresher, Kevin! Okay, so not a huge magical cloud or anything, just crazy weather-type magic destroying the Muggle World. I figured there'd been some type of memory wipe. Still though, rare, random pop-ups of Muggle changing over later than usual I'm sure has happened before. Just a random freak of nature in genetics which happens but not nearly as much as since Marius' meddling.
Vye great line of thinking for the derogatory version! Something that appears real on the outside but is a fake or not the true thing. Like fools gold or cubic zirconia...
As far as the actual term, something along the lines of anomaly in nature.
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Post by Medieval Kevin on Feb 21, 2015 23:50:10 GMT -8
Heidi did you want Marius to pay her a visit? im thinking he would come in person to talk to her. if she agrees he could bring her to hogwarts himself for the ceremony. unless we want it to be a flashback and she is already there
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Post by Vye on Feb 22, 2015 7:09:32 GMT -8
This might sound kind of lame, but I've been looking up terms and things we could use for the muggles and then I thought, "Why don't we just call them Pretenders?" Wizards would refuse to acknowledge them as real wizards and so start calling them things like that maybe. At the very least I hope this helps someone else come up with an idea.
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Post by Hollywood Heidi on Feb 22, 2015 8:04:10 GMT -8
Kevin - I'll PM you on FB. vye - I was thinking along those same lines. Something like mimic. Mimblood? Meh. Something that compares them to something like a bodysnatcher as if they're implying the person stole their magic from a true wizard or witch. Mockblood? Or even something along the lines of parasite as if they are feeding off or soaking up the power of true wizards or witches? I just did a thesaurus search of parasite and the only decent thing I see there is leech. Leechblood? Leechwizard? Or just plain leech? I just did a thesaurus search on the word imposter as well and came up with con, fraud, sham...
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Post by Storyteller on Feb 22, 2015 8:13:28 GMT -8
So, Kevin and I have been talking about Anya's and Kaeden's situation and wanted to run an idea past you guys. I remember reading somewhere that generally, Hogwarts frowns upon taking in new wizards older than eleven/twelve who haven't been to a wizarding school. It's a situation dealing with the fact that they are considered just too old to start learning how to safely harness their powers combined with the idea that Hogwarts students (pureblood, halfblood and Muggleborn alike) are put on an enrollment list at birth. It will definitely cast suspicion on Anya and Kaeden that Marius probably doesn't want. Plus that issue that they really can't be doing sixth year magic at a first year level. So what if Marius had taken them in over the summer and attempted to give them an expedited program of the five years they missed? And when they do join their new classmates, he created false records for them saying that they had come from a different wizarding school? It would keep the spotlight off of them while Marius is doing...well, whatever Marius is doing . Anyway, just an idea! Let me know what you think. As for a title- I think the biggest slap in the face would be to refuse to call them anything magical. They just continue to call them Muggles, no matter what their abilities. If it becomes more common, I think that's when they'd get an official term.
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Post by Vye on Feb 22, 2015 8:30:59 GMT -8
I like that idea Amelia!
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Post by Hollywood Heidi on Feb 22, 2015 8:32:06 GMT -8
Oh, I thought since Marius had already been dabbling and interfering with young people not on that list, that some may have popped up over the years? Perhaps some not as strong as others? Plus the Ministry is notified of unauthorized magic use so how would Marius keep that from them? I thought we mentioned before that because of this, Marius would have talked his way into having the Ministry put him in charge of these anomalies and that during the school year and summer, he'd be personally instructing these rare few when they pop up with grueling, catch-up crash courses. During some of the actual classes when they're not with Marius, they'd be put in the back only to observe and give them some form of illusion of being ingrained with their peers. I didn't know that Hogwarts frowned upon taking in new wizards or witches past a certain age. But then how do those people learn to control their magic or what the proper uses are for it? How do they not become a problem for the wizarding world and a threat to expose the wizarding world to muggles? On a side note, I think it'd take much longer than one summer to catch someone up on five years of magical studies. It'd be worse disasters than even Seamus Finnigan caused, lol!
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Post by Storyteller on Feb 22, 2015 8:46:44 GMT -8
www.springhole.net/writing/better-harry-potter-ocs.htmThis is the only mention I can find now but I'm pretty sure I've seen it elsewhere. I mean, nothing says that we can't change things. I'm just wondering if the new Ministry would really let something like this go on unchecked. They'd have people looking into it.
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Post by Vye on Feb 22, 2015 9:24:59 GMT -8
Maybe Marius has some people in the Ministry working with him so that he can fake records and things without being caught. He could also come up with odd circumstances to explain why they don't know as much as they should. Maybe that they were being home schooled or just went to a bad school. Anyways, I like the idea of just calling them Muggles. I think that really would be the most insulting thing they could do.
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Post by Hollywood Heidi on Feb 22, 2015 9:30:56 GMT -8
I'm totally all about making this mesh properly with the HP world but I need us to all agree on the details and clear up any questions so let's hash this out. Things to consider: It's been two decades. Things, people, the world changes and therefore, the way things are done, rules, laws, etc. change. Marius is trying to manufacture wizards out of squibs and muggles. What plans has he set in place should he be successful? Falsifying one or two people's docs is hard enough but if he's successful and more and more pop up, what then? Also, how many years has be been attempting this and have there been any other hints at success? Now that I thought about it more, Amelia, I do remember them mentioning in the books that they don't like to bring on students past the age but in the books, those people tend to not be able to really use their magic because they never learned how. But what about the people who have uncontrollable spouts, even though rare, because of Marius' meddling? He's messing with the natural order of things which can cause chaos. The Ministry of Magic detects unauthorized use of magic. How would Marius hide this from them for each potential person he's meddled with? Since it's more of a manufactured rather than natural occurrence, would the Ministry not detect it? For Anya, this is the first time she even knows the existence of magic. One summer is not gonna get her anywhere near ready to join her peers. Her magic is new to her as well as unnaturally obtained so therefore chaotic. She didn't get to grow into them and since it was made a part of her through unnatural means, I was in the mind that it doesn't flow naturally through her genetics but more like bounces around, attempting to fuse with a genetic make-up that views it as foreign. I thought Marius would be working on her more and that that was the reason he needed to have her close. If we go by the forged papers route and say she was tutored all summer, I can do a couple flashback posts to show how Anya ended up there on the train as a transfer but again, I'd need to come up with a way to explain how very behind she is an how unpredictable and chaotic she still is with magic. After just one summer, she shouldn't be attempting sixth year magic. Should Marius secretly have her there at Hogwarts? I just didn't want to have another character that's a hidden away secret and can't openly interact with others though. I don't think having him ask the professors to seat her in the back and let her mostly observe would work. A good teacher wouldn't allow that and it'd be a strange thing to ask of them. Let me know if you have any ideas as to how to deal with this unique issue. I'm drawing a bit of a blank! I'll hold off on posting until we can get this hashed out.
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Post by Vye on Feb 22, 2015 9:43:05 GMT -8
I don't know much about what Marius has been up to, but he could be concealing those he meddles with with a particular spell he invented or he could just have that department of the ministry in his pocket. As for Anya, he could say she was home schooled by parents who barely taught her anything and that would explain why she's so terrible. It would also explain why she doesn't talk about her parents at all. By this explanation, her emotions toward her parents are what makes her magic so unpredictable. She won't have to be with the other sixth years, but maybe Marius could get the teachers to give her a sort of accelerated course in a class with just her and Kaeden. I don't know how that would work really, or if the teachers would have the time. These are just some ideas.
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Post by Storyteller on Feb 22, 2015 10:14:03 GMT -8
I mean, it really is a difficult situation. Things definitely change somewhat in twenty years, especially when the last canon we know about the wizarding world was at the tail end of a war that changed most of the ministry. But I don't see it being a completely drastic change and I don't think the general feeling of many wizards themselves would change that much. In the time between the First and Second Wizarding Wars, things did not change all that much. If it is common knowledge that the headmaster of Hogwarts is experimenting on Muggles to turn them into wizards, I'd imagine there is going to be extreme backlash to that. Possibly to the degree that many students would be removed by their parents from Hogwarts or Marius would be asked to step down so that operations at Hogwarts can carry on as normal. From what I read, Hermione was still fighting to dispel discrimination against Muggleborns, I can't imagine the kind of discrimination Muggles made wizards would face.
More than that, though, the Ministry has always been careful to keep the Muggle world as far as possible. I can't see them ever condoning these experiments, especially as it could be considered cruelty to muggles since they don't know what kind of side effects it can cause. And what would be the Ministry's purpose in allowing it? Turning Muggles into wizards does very little for them (other than potentially cause a big problem as Marius' true motives are revealed). You said it best yourself: He's messing with the natural order of things which can cause chaos. It seems weird that this Ministry would be involved at all in that.
What we really need right now is Kevin's input on this as he is the only one who knows how long Marius has been doing this and how many are out there. That will affect any plot decisions we make.
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Post by Hollywood Heidi on Feb 22, 2015 10:14:16 GMT -8
Huh, that could kinda work. I'd need to hear from Kevin to set things in stone because I have no idea how Marius would handle all this. Kevin, I leave it up to you! Yah, I don't think the teachers would have time to tutor them. I think Marius would rather privately tutor them, especially Anya, as a way to observe the extent of her magic and how much control she has over it. Kevin, I again leave this decision up to you. Amelia - I agree that the Ministry would definitely not condone such practices. In fact, they may even go so far as to throw Marius into Azkaban for it. It's definitely cruel as he's using muggles as lab rats without much concern for their well-being or even life. Should he ever approach them, the only exception he might get some of the Ministry members to agree to is helping to "cure" Squibs and even that would be highly controversial.
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Post by booksmart on Feb 22, 2015 10:26:51 GMT -8
Just now reading all of this, and I feel like I need to clarify. Kaeden had reciecved an invitation to Hogwarts when she was 11, she didn't just suddenly have powers at 16. Kaeden just doesn't have any sense of control and has become somewhat of a danger if she can't learn to gain some measure of control. So with Kaeden really just having to take classes to learn how to control her magic, she would be a perfect distraction to allow Marius to be doing whatever his plans with Anya are.
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Post by Hollywood Heidi on Feb 22, 2015 10:31:23 GMT -8
Yup, I did realize that, booksmart. Kaeden decided to ignore the invitation but like in the books, instead of her powers not forming since she didn't go to the classes, she kind of got hold of them and learned to use them in whatever small measures which is what caused the Ministry's concern and interference in her life.
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Post by Vye on Feb 22, 2015 10:40:22 GMT -8
I knew that too. I just meant that they might be lumped together for classes because they are both behind.
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Post by booksmart on Feb 22, 2015 10:40:41 GMT -8
I kinda imagined that when she actually did go to her classes, her spells would end up like Seamus Finnigan's. They just wouldn't go right, or they would go wrong. She's a little unnatural, but not so much that people would be looking to Marius for an explanation.
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Post by booksmart on Feb 22, 2015 10:41:48 GMT -8
Oh okay, sorry for the misunderstanding
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Post by Medieval Kevin on Feb 22, 2015 13:21:48 GMT -8
Okay I'm going to try and weigh in on these issues but I'm behind, let me know if I miss anything.
#1: Yeah Kaeden isn't one of Marius's experiments so she's been living with her powers this whole time, knowing what she 'could' do perhaps? just not necessarily how? If its okay with you, booksmart I'd think she may have been recruited for summer duty and then they will attempt to integrate her into classes. If not we can put her with Anya too entirely up to you.
#2: Times need to change, Marius has been all about that, and he would be pushing for it. There is one person he has been willing to work with in the Ministry and that is Hermione. While their methods are wildly different their goals are more similar than anyone would expect.
#3: He has kept his experiments 100% secret. He hasn't trusted a single person with that (It would just get him in Azkaban if he was lucky. A dementors kiss more likely, if the ministry still used them!). What he would do to them would not be detected because he is not an underage wizard. As far as my research has told me, there was nothing in place to make that kind of detection. The ministry knew about death eaters torturing muggles and killing them because they were not trying to be discrete in any way, shape, or form.
#4: Marius had to face facts and know this would come out eventually if he was successful (Was trying to keep some things about him secret but I might as well add this to his bio now). He spent a great deal of time documenting these rare individuals and filed several dissertations with the ministry and at a certain point prior to his appointment as Headmaster, again with the help of Hermione (Deputy of Magical Law Enforcement), started a program at Hogwarts to help these people become productive members of wizard society.
#5: The program would have been headed up by Marius himself (In addition to his muggle studies class), being the one who put these individuals on the radar. after being appointed headmaster he would continue this class, stepping down from muggle studies
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Post by Medieval Kevin on Feb 22, 2015 13:29:38 GMT -8
I'm thinking it would be an accelerated course but not so much so as all in one summer (Which he could still have been working with them over that time) but initial trials would be for a term to cover one whole year, being such an exclusive program. twice as fast as the other students. so if the student showed promise and came to the summer course, after the winter break they would be starting third year spells and so on and so forth. it has the luxury of catering to the students abilities though. its flexible. in theory a student could move faster as well
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Post by booksmart on Feb 22, 2015 13:32:15 GMT -8
The only problem with Kaeden being there in the summer is that she would already be at Hogwarts and wouldn't need to be on the train. I could just go through and remove her experience on the train. Though she's already interacted with Drew and Carter, though that too could just be deleted.
Though if Marius were to have instructed her in some lessons on control while she was still in the Ministry's custody, then everything could continue as is. She would have had some lessons while still being knew to Hogwarts.
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Post by booksmart on Feb 22, 2015 13:34:20 GMT -8
Another thing is Kaeden's apathy and hatred of magic. She would still be learning at a very slow rate. So summer lessons would be a must.
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Post by Vye on Feb 22, 2015 13:36:34 GMT -8
We can't delete the interaction. It's too much fun.
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Post by booksmart on Feb 22, 2015 13:38:58 GMT -8
I know, I wouldn't want to, but if it is for the good of the plot we would need to.
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Post by Hollywood Heidi on Feb 22, 2015 13:44:48 GMT -8
In regards to the use of magic, I was referring to his experiment subjects, not him so I think the Ministry would be notified of unauthorized use of magic. Even though I think Anya is above the age of detection, I think they might still detect it because she's not someone recognized as a witch? Or definitely be notified if something big enough happens to draw attention. #4 & #5 - Okay, so there is a kind of program at Hogwarts for these anomalies. So Anya would be in that program and probably Kaeden not because she's one of Marius' experiments but because she's a late comer forced by the Ministry to go to classes since she's been misusing her powers in the muggle world. Lol, I can picture young Hermione signing up for those courses just to get ahead! So I was intending my first Anya post was going to be taking place same time as everyone else which means that she wouldn't have been in any summer program or even know of the existence of the magical world. Marius would be the one to tell her about it, introduce her to it, etc. Does that still mesh well with things or should I write it as a flashback? I mean, if he's experimenting, there's nothing that says a person's magical abilities will coincide with school semesters... Honestly, I'm fine with either way. I just need to know how to start and what direction we're going.
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